John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby basheeeer » 31 May 2010, 18:37

Dear Hussain,

I read the article. Its true and I agree that promissed messiah responded to pigott in this way. my apologies for wrong analysis of the publication.

"If he does not repent from his irrelevant claim he shall be soon anhiliated "

He did not respond to promissed messiah and was repented from his public claims and kept a low profile. he was eventually anhiliated in his life and the last member of his group died in 1956.
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby Hussain » 31 May 2010, 18:50

Brother, I already anticipated this would be your next response. Please pray to Allah (SWT) for guidance, much the way I do. There is no request to reply to the warning, Pigott is told to either repent or die during the lifetime of MGA. Mirza Ghulam Ahmad died in 1908, fact. Piggot continued claiming he was God in 1909, fact. He did not repent, open your heart and come back to Islam. I do not think you have read the blog on this otherwise you would have already known this:

http://thecult.info/blog/2010/03/27/joh ... th-pigott/

Please do not let your pride blind you. Pride is the same reason Shaytaan did not bow when commanded to do so by Allah (SWT). Be fair and unbiased in your approach, return to Islam.
"The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number." (Sahih Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 56, Number 661)
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby basheeeer » 31 May 2010, 19:09

Well If it was a failed prophecy the Jamat wont publish that article. However we still publish that.

The fact of repentance and whether he kept on claiming to be the God is matter of further research. I will look up on that.
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby Hussain » 31 May 2010, 19:31

Your 'Jamaat' didn't publish the article till 100 years after brother Shahid and Akber exposed it using the medium of the Internet. Only after this exposition did your organisation address it and publish it, why is that so?

We have already done the research for you. It is a matter of FACT that after MGA died Pigott continued claiming he was God. If I can assist your research in any way please do let me know.

You may be interested to know that Mubasher Ahmad in his book 'Approaching The West' wrote the following:

“…the Church of England took stern action against him, and he was defrocked and thus utterly humiliated. But Smyth-Pigott persisted in his arrogance and announced: ‘I am God. It does not matter what they do.’” (Approaching The West – Page 16)

Direct Link: http://www.alislam.org/library/books/Ap ... 0817MN.pdf

Please do your own research and tell me in which year was Pigott defrocked?
"The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number." (Sahih Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 56, Number 661)
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby xiaahmad » 01 Jun 2010, 09:07

Basheeer please go through the blog entry that Hussain wrote that will help u as well if ur willing to learn
Prophet Muhammad (SAW) said: "Indeed, messengership and Prophethood have terminated. So, there is no Messenger after me and no Prophet”.
(Jami' Tirmidhi, hadith 2272
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby xiaahmad » 08 Jun 2010, 05:06

[b]Basheer he again made that claim in 1909 thats after MGA's death[b]

and according to MGA's own prophecy he (pigott) wont gona repent
Prophet Muhammad (SAW) said: "Indeed, messengership and Prophethood have terminated. So, there is no Messenger after me and no Prophet”.
(Jami' Tirmidhi, hadith 2272
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby xiaahmad » 10 Jun 2010, 10:33

The excuse that they try to give is:

Malfoozat Volume 2, pages 439-440: Just Weeks after the above mentioned Warning was sent.. Promised Messiah (as) mentioned Dowie and Piggott..
“As compared to Americans, we are more linked with the Europeans. If he (Piggott) accepts (muqabila karay) and this match/challenge is published then we hope that God will show some sign….”


But they ignore that the pamlphet that MGA sent adressing Pigot does not even talks about accepting or rejecting challenge

it simply says:

"The Death of the pigott within my life time shall be another sign of truth"
Prophet Muhammad (SAW) said: "Indeed, messengership and Prophethood have terminated. So, there is no Messenger after me and no Prophet”.
(Jami' Tirmidhi, hadith 2272
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby abdulghaffar » 12 Jul 2010, 14:15

There was a person who replied to the corrosponding Blog post regarding Pigott which I think was not answered thoroughly.

The person, at the end of the comments section, wrote:

(2) It is not necessary for a true prophet that “all” of his warnings come true. The above quoted verse says “some of that which he threatens you with will surely befall you”. If all warnings had to befall upon opponents, then why did not Allah use the word “all” and why “some”?


He said so quoting,
“And a believing man from among the people of Pharaoh, who concealed his faith, said, “Will you slay a man because he says, ‘My Lord is Allah,’ while he has brought you clear proofs from your Lord? And if he be a liar, on him will be the sin of his lie; but if he is truthful, then some of that which he threatens you with will surely befall you. Certainly Allah guides not one who is a transgressor, and a liar.” [Al-M`umin 40;29]"


The quote actually reads, "40:28 (Y. Ali) A believer, a man from among the people of Pharaoh, who had concealed his faith, said: "Will ye slay a man because he says, 'My Lord is Allah.?- when he has indeed come to you with Clear (Signs) from your Lord? and if he be a liar, on him is (the sin of) his lie: but, if he is telling the Truth, then will fall on you something of the (calamity) of which he warns you: Truly Allah guides not one who transgresses and lies!"

It must be noted that Allah is quoting a person who came forward who had hid his beliefs. This person was not given revelation and it is obvious that he is just a man who came forward who had been concealing his faith. Just because Allah "quotes" the words of men and women does not mean that they had received it from Allah. In that case, those who say that the Prophet pbuh was doing magic and was insane (may Allah curse them till eternity) must have gotten the words from Allah since it appears in the Quran.

The man is pleading saying, "If he's lying then he has to deal with that problem, but if he's telling the truth surely something must happen...at the very least one or two things that he's saying has to happen....so please turn to Allah." It's a plea to iman to avoid calamity in this life and the hereafter, not a hidden secret meeting that "all" prophecies do not need to come true. Indeed they do. When a Prophet comes with truth he presents the truth and the whole truth. I'd like to remind that as far as the Prophet PBUH is concerned, his prophecies came true. From the winning of Byzantine to the conquest of Mekka to the destruction and persistence of Abu Lahab.

And Allah knows best.
"Every claim to prophethood after him is falsehood and deceit." -Imam al-Tahawi (d. 321 AH)
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby Fuad » 18 Jul 2010, 19:21

@abdulghaffar

Here is the word-by-word translation of وَإِنْ يَكُ صَادِقًا يُصِبْكُمْ بَعْضُ الَّذِي يَعِدُكُمْ which is mentioned in verse 40:29

وإن : If
يك : he be
صادقاً : truthful
يصبكم : there will befall you
بعض : part of
الذي : what
يعدكم : he promises

If you read the remaining verses of the same Chapter, you would know that these promises are:

مَنْ عَمِلَ سَيِّئَةً فَلَا يُجْزَى إِلَّا مِثْلَهَا وَمَنْ عَمِلَ صَالِحًا مِنْ ذَكَرٍ أَوْ أُنْثَى وَهُوَ مُؤْمِنٌ فَأُولَئِكَ يَدْخُلُونَ الْجَنَّةَ يُرْزَقُونَ فِيهَا بِغَيْرِ حِسَابٍ

40:40 ((Whosoever does an evil deed, will not be requited except the like thereof, and whosoever does a righteous deed, whether male or female and is a true believer in the Oneness of Allah, such will enter Paradise, where they will be provided therein with all things in abundance without limit))


Accordingly whoever does an evil shall only receive the bad part of the promise (i.e. he shall not be requited except the like thereof), and whoever does good shall only receive the good part of the promise (i.e. he shall enter Paradise).

Therefore each one shall receive one part of the promise only; either the good part, or the bad one.
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Re: John Hugh Smyth-Pigott

Postby aqeel » 27 Aug 2010, 09:34

aslamoalikum

The opponents of the promised messiah have really out done any other enemies of Islam. Let's examine it.
You guys have proven that a person who is claiming to be Allah besides Allah and the messiah ( ie Simon Piggot) is correct and was proved superior over a Muslim ( ie promised messiah who, no matter what you think of him, at least said the Kalima shahada). WELL DONE YOU GUYS. I am sure Allah will be very pleased.

You guys remind of the hadith where when the enemies of Islam cursed the holy prophet (saaw) and his family the sahaba were willing to fight but when they praised their own god the sahaba kept quite. What did the Holy prophet (saaw) say “why are you quite now. Now is the time to fight, for they are attacking Allah almighty”. I guess you guys would not only be the quite ones but also go and support the enemies of Allah.
Your hatred for the promised messiah: as: has no limits. May Allah set those limits for you.

As you guys only understand facts so here we go:

Fact: The promised Messiah: as: never spoke or understood English.

Fact: Someone else would have to translate the article in to English.

Fact: The person translating from Urdu to English must have translated whatever the Promised Mesiah said in Urdu to just one word “repent” as they understood it.

Fact: The claim of Simon Piggot was made very public before the challenge from his own words and declarations.

Fact: Your research is based on what his followers believed and NOT HIS OWN declaration after the challenge.

Fact: Christians the followers of Christ :as: believe he was god and son of god etc.. Yet nowhere is there evidence from Christ :as: own words.

Fact: The promised Messiah :as: was also asked to “repent” by many opponents and in response continued to write articles, publications and still held public meetings till his last days.

Fact: Alexandra Dowie in his 50s publicly accepted the challenge of the Promised Messiah :as: in his 70s and yet Died.

Fact: These prophecies conclusions you mock were not the works of the Promised Messiah but the works of Allah Almighty. These prophesies do not prove the truth of the Promised Messiah:as: as much as the truth of the existence of a living Alah Almighty.


Kind regards
aqeel
Waslaam
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