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	<title>Comments on: Out of Context Vol. 1</title>
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	<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/</link>
	<description>Inviting from Ahmadiyya to Islam</description>
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		<title>By: rationalist</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13413</link>
		<dc:creator>rationalist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 04:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13413</guid>
		<description>contradicted is a bad word, I couldnt think of a better word at the time.  

Here is an example:

1.  Allah told us that alcohol was bad--he did not issue a standing order

2.  Later, allah ordered muslims to not to come to prayer intoxicated.

3.  Later, allah gave a decisive decision on the matter, he said that muslims could not drink alcohol at all.  

We follow the later revelations, we dont take these revelations as situational.  I think Imam Maliki in his book of tradition writes about the alcohol story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>contradicted is a bad word, I couldnt think of a better word at the time.  </p>
<p>Here is an example:</p>
<p>1.  Allah told us that alcohol was bad&#8211;he did not issue a standing order</p>
<p>2.  Later, allah ordered muslims to not to come to prayer intoxicated.</p>
<p>3.  Later, allah gave a decisive decision on the matter, he said that muslims could not drink alcohol at all.  </p>
<p>We follow the later revelations, we dont take these revelations as situational.  I think Imam Maliki in his book of tradition writes about the alcohol story.</p>
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		<title>By: Asad</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13406</link>
		<dc:creator>Asad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 02:38:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13406</guid>
		<description>Brother Rationalist, 

When you make the claim, &quot; In my personal opinion arabic was not a perfect language at the time when the Quran was revealed. &quot;,  it creates many serious problems.  My feeling is that you are not realizing the severity of it.  Once you make this claim, it does not leave you with any moral authority  to ask other people for a debate on the translation or meaning of a Quranic verse.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brother Rationalist, </p>
<p>When you make the claim, &#8221; In my personal opinion arabic was not a perfect language at the time when the Quran was revealed. &#8220;,  it creates many serious problems.  My feeling is that you are not realizing the severity of it.  Once you make this claim, it does not leave you with any moral authority  to ask other people for a debate on the translation or meaning of a Quranic verse.</p>
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		<title>By: Shahid</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13405</link>
		<dc:creator>Shahid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 02:32:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13405</guid>
		<description>rationalist, you&#039;re talking about abrogation, not contradiction I take it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rationalist, you&#8217;re talking about abrogation, not contradiction I take it?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: rationalist</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13404</link>
		<dc:creator>rationalist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 02:23:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13404</guid>
		<description>Lutf you are an idiot.  

Every mujadid that ever existed in the history of Islam endorsed the theory that the Quran contradicted itself, they endorsed the theory of Mansukh, even shah wali ullah endorsed this idea.  

So its not just me but every mujadid.  

WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO--CIRCA 1885</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lutf you are an idiot.  </p>
<p>Every mujadid that ever existed in the history of Islam endorsed the theory that the Quran contradicted itself, they endorsed the theory of Mansukh, even shah wali ullah endorsed this idea.  </p>
<p>So its not just me but every mujadid.  </p>
<p>WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO&#8211;CIRCA 1885</p>
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		<title>By: rationalist</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13390</link>
		<dc:creator>rationalist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 20:01:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13390</guid>
		<description>@ lutf, you are a typical qadiani with no backbone.  Instead of answering my questions you are countering with your OWN line of questioning.  Did mirza tahir ahmad teach you that?  

I remember that mirza tahir ahmad asked a person if they beat their wife--or he gave an example of this type of questioning.  He said that a yes or no answer wasn&#039;t correct at all in this scenario.  He was developing a strategy for argumentation.  

Lutf, I am smarter than you are, your little tricks aren&#039;t going to work.  Go play on the freeway my friend, I don&#039;t have time for your stupidity.  Go post on your own forum--oh I forgot--Masroor shut that down when he heard it was a free thing and he wasn&#039;t getting any money for that.  Someone told him that it wasn&#039;t like selling books.  

MKA should open a college fund and use the money to get masroor some speech classes, a 10 year old could give a better speech than that guy.  

WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO---CIRCA 1885</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ lutf, you are a typical qadiani with no backbone.  Instead of answering my questions you are countering with your OWN line of questioning.  Did mirza tahir ahmad teach you that?  </p>
<p>I remember that mirza tahir ahmad asked a person if they beat their wife&#8211;or he gave an example of this type of questioning.  He said that a yes or no answer wasn&#8217;t correct at all in this scenario.  He was developing a strategy for argumentation.  </p>
<p>Lutf, I am smarter than you are, your little tricks aren&#8217;t going to work.  Go play on the freeway my friend, I don&#8217;t have time for your stupidity.  Go post on your own forum&#8211;oh I forgot&#8211;Masroor shut that down when he heard it was a free thing and he wasn&#8217;t getting any money for that.  Someone told him that it wasn&#8217;t like selling books.  </p>
<p>MKA should open a college fund and use the money to get masroor some speech classes, a 10 year old could give a better speech than that guy.  </p>
<p>WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO&#8212;CIRCA 1885</p>
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		<title>By: Lutf</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13370</link>
		<dc:creator>Lutf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 16:40:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13370</guid>
		<description>I think you have made it abundantly clear that you do not see Quran as a flawless book..  We will need to discuss that first..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you have made it abundantly clear that you do not see Quran as a flawless book..  We will need to discuss that first..</p>
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		<title>By: rationalist</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13369</link>
		<dc:creator>rationalist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 16:30:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13369</guid>
		<description>@lutf, why are you not addressing any of the real concerns here?

In my personal opinion arabic was not a perfect language at the time when the Quran was revealed.  This is a personal opinion of mine.  

1.  Why was john the baptist killed unjustly?  He didnt last 23 years.  His head was cut off.  

WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO--CIRCA 1885</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@lutf, why are you not addressing any of the real concerns here?</p>
<p>In my personal opinion arabic was not a perfect language at the time when the Quran was revealed.  This is a personal opinion of mine.  </p>
<p>1.  Why was john the baptist killed unjustly?  He didnt last 23 years.  His head was cut off.  </p>
<p>WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DO&#8211;CIRCA 1885</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Lutf</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13366</link>
		<dc:creator>Lutf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 10:06:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13366</guid>
		<description>I have to ask you for clarification here.. 

&quot;Arabic was not perfect&quot;.. Do you mean to say that Quran has flaws?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to ask you for clarification here.. </p>
<p>&#8220;Arabic was not perfect&#8221;.. Do you mean to say that Quran has flaws?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Asad</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13362</link>
		<dc:creator>Asad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 05:05:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13362</guid>
		<description>Brother Rationalist, 

If  &quot;This verse could be understood to mean ALL, that is a possibility, ....&quot;, then  you should not have wasted your precious time in writing this article.  

There are many strong arguments that one can employ while arguing against Ahmadiyya. It is always good to use Muhkamat in our arguments instead of Mutashabihat.  It does not help that first you write  two pages  for supporting an argument  and then you inform your readers:  &quot; well .... there is a possibility .......&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brother Rationalist, </p>
<p>If  &#8220;This verse could be understood to mean ALL, that is a possibility, &#8230;.&#8221;, then  you should not have wasted your precious time in writing this article.  </p>
<p>There are many strong arguments that one can employ while arguing against Ahmadiyya. It is always good to use Muhkamat in our arguments instead of Mutashabihat.  It does not help that first you write  two pages  for supporting an argument  and then you inform your readers:  &#8221; well &#8230;. there is a possibility &#8230;&#8230;.&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: rationalist</title>
		<link>http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/comment-page-1/#comment-13346</link>
		<dc:creator>rationalist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 22:55:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecult.info/blog/2009/12/01/out-of-context-vol-1/#comment-13346</guid>
		<description>I think that the arabic wasnt perfect and it has multiple gray areas that can be exploited if someone has the desire to do so.  Necessity is the mother of invention.  Mirza Mahmud invented a new meaning of 4:69 that did not previously exist.  

ANOTHER POINT

3:144 was revealed before the status of jesus was revealed to Muhammad.  The status of jesus was revealed categorically in 4:157.  During the battle of Uhud, Allah had not yet revealed as to Muhammad as to what happened to jesus during the crucifiction.  When allah revealed 3:144 muslims had no idea as to what happened with Jesus on the cross.  Muslims only knew what the jews and christians believed.

3:55 only gives a conclusion of what happened, but it is not as categorical as 4:157.  And it can argued that 3:55 may have been revealed after 3:144.  


gotcha

WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DOOOOO</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that the arabic wasnt perfect and it has multiple gray areas that can be exploited if someone has the desire to do so.  Necessity is the mother of invention.  Mirza Mahmud invented a new meaning of 4:69 that did not previously exist.  </p>
<p>ANOTHER POINT</p>
<p>3:144 was revealed before the status of jesus was revealed to Muhammad.  The status of jesus was revealed categorically in 4:157.  During the battle of Uhud, Allah had not yet revealed as to Muhammad as to what happened to jesus during the crucifiction.  When allah revealed 3:144 muslims had no idea as to what happened with Jesus on the cross.  Muslims only knew what the jews and christians believed.</p>
<p>3:55 only gives a conclusion of what happened, but it is not as categorical as 4:157.  And it can argued that 3:55 may have been revealed after 3:144.  </p>
<p>gotcha</p>
<p>WE CAN WHAT WE WILL DOOOOO</p>
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